AnsweredHot!Tower block disaster.

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Author
OEM
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2017/06/15 14:53:59 (permalink)

Tower block disaster.

Been reading up and retweeting half-read stuff and it's clearly a cost cutting endeavour that has horribly back fired.

The material panels used in the cladding are basically very thinly aluminium wrapped polyurethane. You can use an alternative mineral based compound filling that has a much higher resistance in terms of flammablilty. Costs more tho. PE has much the same ignitionablity as petrol and burns 3 times hotter than wood. It was a disaster that was preventable and predicted by residents in letters written to KCTMO.

Politics will take over in what happens next but fuck that. Deserves it's own thread you cunts.


#1
gutlessrhyme
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Re: Tower block disaster. 2017/06/15 14:59:28 (permalink)
I think you might have missed the boat. There is already about 5 pages of debate and suggestion in the Politics thread.

#2
RUSSELL CLARTY
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Re: Tower block disaster. 2017/06/15 15:01:01 (permalink)
It probably does deserve its own thread- but this is a watershed moment for the Tory party and one that I doubt they will recover from any time soon, hence it being a big ting on the politics thread


#3
OEM
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Re: Tower block disaster. 2017/06/15 15:03:39 (permalink)
Ffs. This forum is officially a cunt.


#4
wiseacre
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Re: Tower block disaster. 2017/06/15 15:06:25 (permalink)
I was speaking to a design coordinator today. That cladding meets the standards, but it's sposed to have a 3-4mm intumescent strip both between floors and every 10m (?) vertically too. Doesn't look like this was installed, at least not correctly.
post edited by wiseacre - 2017/06/15 15:13:24

no
#5
dotarr
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Re: Tower block disaster. 2017/06/15 15:10:33 (permalink)
Assuming the stuff is up to scratch but flammable, then it's probably in all these cheap new-build blocks and student blocks that are cropping up all over the places as well as renovated tower blocks. The potential for the scandal is massive.
 
Also, if it transpires that it's the regs that are not up to scratch it'll be like Ronan Point all over again.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ronan_Point#Effect_on_legislation
 
post edited by Slippery Mick - 2017/06/15 15:12:32
#6
OEM
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Re: Tower block disaster. 2017/06/15 15:11:05 (permalink)
wiseacre

Also, the installer changed their statement, removing parts that said they met all fire regs.


Not the only thing that's changed. The company who undertook the renovation work removed it from their website. Either way, you're fucked lol


#7
OEM
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Re: Tower block disaster. 2017/06/15 15:15:02 (permalink)
simon.r
Assuming the stuff is up to scratch but flammable, then it's probably in all these cheap new-build blocks and student blocks that are cropping up all over the places as well as renovated tower blocks. The potential for the scandal is massive.


Do you remember someting similar happening in Dubai?

Mate of mine was there during the new year celebrations and there was confusion as to whether the fireworks display would continue. A massive fire that didn't turn into a disaster because of working sprinkler systems and flats/apartments that did their job of not allowing the fire not to spread.


#8
Lrrr
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Re: Tower block disaster. 2017/06/15 15:15:30 (permalink)
Jungle Dave
It probably does deserve its own thread- but this is a watershed moment for the Tory party and one that I doubt they will recover from any time soon, hence it being a big ting on the politics thread




You can't help but feel TM was slightly happy with the timing of this. It's a shit storm for sure, but less so than te one she was in last week.

#9
wiseacre
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Re: Tower block disaster. 2017/06/15 15:18:11 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby PapaJaro 2017/06/15 18:46:04
Retrofitting sprinklers themselves isn't the problem, it's the fuck off tank you need to put on top that is. It's unlikely a building built 45 years ago would be structurally capable of taking a weight way beyond its design.

Plus sprinklers are not designed to all run at once, just isolated areas wherever the bulbs pop, and then only for 20 minutes or so until the system is drained
post edited by wiseacre - 2017/06/15 15:20:01

no
#10
RUSSELL CLARTY
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Re: Tower block disaster. 2017/06/15 15:31:53 (permalink)
Lrrr
 
 
You can't help but feel TM was slightly happy with the timing of this. It's a shit storm for sure, but less so than te one she was in last week.




 
Give her time. I can see the pitchforks on the horizon right now. 


#11
OEM
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Re: Tower block disaster. 2017/06/15 15:32:40 (permalink)
That cladding on that building is a monumental error. I hope the person responsible is made to pay.


#12
dotarr
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Re: Tower block disaster. 2017/06/15 15:35:53 (permalink)
OEM
simon.r
Assuming the stuff is up to scratch but flammable, then it's probably in all these cheap new-build blocks and student blocks that are cropping up all over the places as well as renovated tower blocks. The potential for the scandal is massive.


Do you remember someting similar happening in Dubai?

Mate of mine was there during the new year celebrations and there was confusion as to whether the fireworks display would continue. A massive fire that didn't turn into a disaster because of working sprinkler systems and flats/apartments that did their job of not allowing the fire not to spread.



Yeah there was. And there's been one in Melbourne apparently.
 
The sprinklers wouldn't help with fire up the sides but they may help with the isolated initial fire.
#13
gutlessrhyme
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Re: Tower block disaster. 2017/06/15 15:36:51 (permalink)
Let's face it, if you outsource this sort of shit, you leave it up to Market forces. The cladding will have been 'safe' in terms of passing whatever minimum requirements are in place, but it's likely to be the cheapest available. 
simon.r
The sprinklers wouldn't help with fire up the sides but they may help with the isolated initial fire.


I think the point is that with sprinklers, the fire would have been unlikely to reach the outsides of the tower.

#14
dotarr
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Re: Tower block disaster. 2017/06/15 15:41:04 (permalink)
Yes gutless, that's why I said they might help with the initial fire.
#15
frizzyd
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Re: Tower block disaster. 2017/06/15 15:46:45 (permalink)
OEM
That cladding on that building is a monumental error. I hope the person responsible is made to pay.



I've said this on the other thread but my father in law had a rant about this last night, him, his family and friends were all bought up on that estate or the ones nearby in White City and Ladbroke Grove.
 
Even in the late 60’s and 70’s when they lived there, fire prevention was not what it is these days there were fires in the blocks but they were generally all isolated to the flat which caught fire through the design, as each flat was a self-contained fire proof unit.
 
Now these flats have uPVC windows instead of Steel window frames, coupled with the outside cladding, the basic foundations of what made these tower blocks fire safe is no longer being adhered to
#16
wiseacre
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Re: Tower block disaster. 2017/06/15 15:57:53 (permalink)
it was a hot day, chances are the window where the fire started was open.

no
#17
dotarr
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Re: Tower block disaster. 2017/06/15 16:00:43 (permalink)
upvc is fire retardant anyway (the c is for chlorine).
#18
frizzyd
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Re: Tower block disaster. 2017/06/15 16:21:29 (permalink)
uPVC frames are simply not as fire retardant as steel frames would be....
 
The window's being open is moot IF the building has just concrete between the flats i.e. no cladding
#19
Goodone
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Re: Tower block disaster. 2017/06/15 17:02:17 (permalink)
gutlessrhyme
Let's face it, if you outsource this sort of shit, you leave it up to Market forces. The cladding will have been 'safe' in terms of passing whatever minimum requirements are in place, but it's likely to be the cheapest available


Ahaaaaa
Let's wait for the result if enquiry if the tower wasn't in line with regulations then that's not market forces that's criminal
#20
gutlessrhyme
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Re: Tower block disaster. 2017/06/15 17:31:04 (permalink)
I'm speculating, Goodone.

#21
Goodone
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Re: Tower block disaster. 2017/06/15 17:36:43 (permalink)
U get down with your bad self
#22
JUDGEDREDD
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Re: Tower block disaster. 2017/06/16 07:20:09 (permalink)
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/quick-thinking-mum-saves-family-10628089
 
This is what I thought would be my only option, flood the fuck out the place and hope for the best
#23
Geordie007
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Re: Tower block disaster. 2017/06/16 07:37:07 (permalink)
I see that sadly, Lily Allen has piped up about this saying that the mainstream media are keeping the casualty numbers down and lying to us because someone told her theres been at least 130 deaths. She misses the point that all media outlets ive seen have said that the death toll will rise but she needs her 5 minutes of fame off the back of a tragedy.
 
 
 
#24
Geordie007
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Re: Tower block disaster. 2017/06/16 07:42:31 (permalink)
#25
_Modus_
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Re: Tower block disaster. 2017/06/16 09:06:40 (permalink)
geordie007
I see that sadly, Lily Allen has piped up about this saying that the mainstream media are keeping the casualty numbers down and lying to us because someone told her theres been at least 130 deaths. She misses the point that all media outlets ive seen have said that the death toll will rise but she needs her 5 minutes of fame off the back of a tragedy.
 



Yeah she's fucked up coming out with that shit. That's a Katie Hopkins level of discourse post-tragedy.
 
Everywhere has reported that deaths are likely to go up "by the dozens" or "as far as 100", they just rightly don't want to guess an exact figure because no one knows yet. 
#26
Whagwan
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Re: Tower block disaster. 2017/06/16 09:22:42 (permalink)
Victim blaming from Nick Paget-Brown:
 
http://www.independent.co...wn-claim-a7792736.html
#27
RUSSELL CLARTY
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Re: Tower block disaster. 2017/06/16 09:29:51 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby wiseacre 2017/06/16 10:25:02
I think we need to give Lily Allen a break and just ignore her when she comes out with stuff like this. 
 
There is no malice behind what she says, her head's all over the place from what we see of her, we know where she is coming from- perhaps we should save our ire for more deserving targets 
 
Compare her outburst with a national newspaper coldly and cynically printing a guys photo, name and suggesting that a) he started the fire and b) he was responsible for the horrific outcome by fucking off without raising an alarm. 
 
 


#28
_Modus_
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Re: Tower block disaster. 2017/06/16 09:35:35 (permalink)
Jungle Dave
 
 Compare her outburst with a national newspaper coldly and cynically printing a guys photo, name and suggesting that a) he started the fire and b) he was responsible for the horrific outcome by fucking off without raising an alarm. 




Agree, that's a thousand times worse. 
#29
Geordie007
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Re: Tower block disaster. 2017/06/16 09:43:48 (permalink)
Jungle Dave
I think we need to give Lily Allen a break and just ignore her when she comes out with stuff like this. 
 
There is no malice behind what she says, her head's all over the place from what we see of her, we know where she is coming from- perhaps we should save our ire for more deserving targets 
 
Compare her outburst with a national newspaper coldly and cynically printing a guys photo, name and suggesting that a) he started the fire and b) he was responsible for the horrific outcome by fucking off without raising an alarm. 
 
 




 
Fucking hell what paper was that? Proper shit thign to do.
#30
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