Helpful ReplyHot!ISIS Talk & Speculation

Page: < 12345.. > >> Showing page 4 of 11
Author
SW14
  • Total Posts : 7921
  • Status: offline
Re: ISIS Talk & Speculation 2017/04/15 18:26:26 (permalink)
It was the late, great Christopher Hitchens' birthday today. Here is what he had to say about Islamophpbia

"Resist while you can before the right to complain is taken away from you...you will be told you can't complain because you're islamaphobic"

https://twitter.com/countermoonbat/status/852740672243224576

Surely one of the greatest minds of his time. Intelligent enough to see that Islam is not only complete bullshit but is extremely dangerous, totalitarian bullshit.
#91
gutlessrhyme
  • Total Posts : 18959
  • Status: offline
Re: ISIS Talk & Speculation 2017/04/15 22:00:33 (permalink)
Racism is a term that isn't always actually used for blanket misrepresentation of race. It can encapsulate religion. Obviously

http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/8591660

And yes, SW14. Your constant painting of Muslims as being the cause of everything wrong with the world is racist in my eyes.

Call it extreme lefty bullshit if you need to and cry when someone calls you racist - as is the common practice these days. But if people are calling you racist - it's probably cos you're being racist.

It's PC gone mad!

#92
gutlessrhyme
  • Total Posts : 18959
  • Status: offline
Re: ISIS Talk & Speculation 2017/04/15 22:06:02 (permalink)
DJaySwitch
Sorry gutless but youre just coming across as a total extreme lefty who dismisses anything he doesnt agree with as "racist". Not sure whats more annoying, actual racism or that tbh. Both are totally ridiculous.


Bollocks, for years he has painted Muslims with the same negative brush on this forum. He sometimes tried to paint is as "anti Islamist" but it's anti Islam. It's racist language and should be called out for what it is.

#93
gutlessrhyme
  • Total Posts : 18959
  • Status: offline
Re: ISIS Talk & Speculation 2017/04/15 22:09:37 (permalink)
SW14
Islamophobia is a racket to insulate Islam from well deserved criticism. People that conflate it with racism are particularly contemptible.

Are you phobic of: 1) the Death penalty for apostates 2) Child brides 3) Stoning adulterers to death 4) Beheading people 5) Rape 6) Death for blasphemers 7) Beating your wife 8) Limb dismemberment?

I am. If you aren't, there's something wrong with you. That doesn't mean that you hate all Muslims and that all Muslims behave like this or believe this, but we should ALL be phobic of such disgusting beliefs that claim to be the total solution for all mankind.


How about FUCK YOU.

All Muslims I know aren't fond of the death penalty, child brides or stoning. But you won't digest this because you've got it stuck in your head that all Muslims are fundamentalists who follow all this bullshit to the T. Just like all Christians follow the Old Testament to the T. Oh wait no, they don't.

You have a clear agenda, and you're being a dick.

#94
PapaJaro
  • Total Posts : 6506
  • Status: offline
Re: ISIS Talk & Speculation 2017/04/15 22:13:20 (permalink)
gutlessrhyme
Racism is a term that isn't always actually used for blanket misrepresentation of race. It can encapsulate religion. Obviously

http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/8591660

And yes, SW14. Your constant painting of Muslims as being the cause of everything wrong with the world is racist in my eyes. 

Call it extreme lefty bullshit if you need to and cry when someone calls you racist - as is the common practice these days. But if people are calling you racist - it's probably cos you're being racist.

It's PC gone mad!

 
A person's dislike of a religion may or may not be fuelled by that person's racism (especially when that religion's adherents tend to be darker skinned) but all of SW14's attacks that I've read have been against the perceived tenets/beliefs of Islam. I've not read anything actually racist (although I stand to be corrected).
 
Someone on the Huffington Post may wish to redefine racism as a sense of cultural superiority, but I think most people would see that as moving the goal posts somewhat. 
post edited by PapaJaro - 2017/04/15 22:14:32
#95
gutlessrhyme
  • Total Posts : 18959
  • Status: offline
Re: ISIS Talk & Speculation 2017/04/15 22:24:25 (permalink)
That's all well and good but the sentiment of what he's saying is the same. You can pick apart the semantics because the term "racism" has such negative connotations that you might not like, but it's the same thing in my eyes.

#96
Goodone
  • Total Posts : 4116
  • Status: offline
Re: ISIS Talk & Speculation 2017/04/15 22:29:50 (permalink)
gutlessrhyme
. But if people are calling you racist - it's probably cos you're being racist.


Or because you're a simpleton who would rather conveniently dismiss alternative views as racist rather than engage in the points raised and fuel your own sense of moral superiority.

Your strawmanning of some of the comments raised would suggest this is the case
#97
gutlessrhyme
  • Total Posts : 18959
  • Status: offline
Re: ISIS Talk & Speculation 2017/04/15 22:33:16 (permalink)
Yeah yeah dismissing alternative views bla bla

Do you read SW14s posts?

#98
Goodone
  • Total Posts : 4116
  • Status: offline
Re: ISIS Talk & Speculation 2017/04/15 22:39:17 (permalink)
Lately I have and he's speaking sense... if you disagree then happy to be proved wrong but simply dismissing views as racist when they aren't is reductive and only exacerbating the very issue we are debating
#99
SW14
  • Total Posts : 7921
  • Status: offline
Re: ISIS Talk & Speculation 2017/04/15 23:02:18 (permalink)
It's hard to have a discussion with somehow who dismisses criticisms of Islamic scripture which are being used to justify despicable atrocities (just today, 100+ Shia civilian evacuees murdered in Syria by Islamists and an Ahmadi torn limb from limb in Pakistan for blasphemy) because he plays 5 a side with a sound lad called Naz.
 
Those people are dead because of Islamic scripture which says that apostates and heretics (which Shia and Ahmadiyya are considered) should be killed. Most people agree that a literal interpretation of Islamic scripture is fuelling these acts of terror, which wouldn't be a problem if it was a peaceful text. It isn't.
 
That's simply one example. One day. There will be more tomorrow and the next day and it's getting worse. 
 
You must have wilfully ignored the part that I said
That doesn't mean that you hate all Muslims and that all Muslims behave like this or believe this
because that doesn't fit your own agenda. An agenda of intellectual cowardice from an intellectual minnow who wishes to conflate valid criticisms of problematic doctrines being used to justify appalling violence and intolerance with racism. 
 
 
Give yourself a shake.
 
post edited by SW14 - 2017/04/15 23:03:58
SW14
  • Total Posts : 7921
  • Status: offline
Re: ISIS Talk & Speculation 2017/04/15 23:25:10 (permalink)
That article is absolute rot as well. Race doesn't exist but racism does, in the form of "cultural" discrimination. How convenient.

Muslims aren't a homogenous culture either. The Subcontinent has a very different culture from the Gulf for example.
gutlessrhyme
  • Total Posts : 18959
  • Status: offline
Re: ISIS Talk & Speculation 2017/04/16 07:47:29 (permalink)
SW14
It's hard to have a discussion with somehow who dismisses criticisms of Islamic scripture which are being used to justify despicable atrocities (just today, 100+ Shia civilian evacuees murdered in Syria by Islamists and an Ahmadi torn limb from limb in Pakistan for blasphemy) because he plays 5 a side with a sound lad called Naz.

Surely it's the done thing to judge the entire religion across the whole world based on one man?

Oh wait no, not just him. Every single Muslim I've ever met and the vast majority of Muslims across the world.
 
SW14
Those people are dead because of Islamic scripture

No, they're dead because they were bombed, or executed by terrorists.

SW14
You must have wilfully ignored the part that I said
That doesn't mean that you hate all Muslims and that all Muslims behave like this or believe this
because that doesn't fit your own agenda. An agenda of intellectual cowardice from an intellectual minnow who wishes to conflate valid criticisms of problematic doctrines being used to justify appalling violence and intolerance with racism. 
 
 
Give yourself a shake.
 


We're never going to agree on this.

I get you're trying to blame the faith/scripture and not every single Muslim. But by doing something to counter that (what, exactly? Other than anti Muslim rhetoric) you just vilify all the followers, most of whom are normal people.

By all means, keep telling yourself "this must be stopped" and wagging your finger in anger. I'm sure if you ban the Burka this whole situation will just disappear completely and we'll all give you a pat on the back.

Goodone
  • Total Posts : 4116
  • Status: offline
Re: ISIS Talk & Speculation 2017/04/16 08:18:33 (permalink)
Gutless have you ever read any sw14 posts because I think you're missing the point... i just can't work out whether it's willful or you're just lazily spewing out charges of racism and islamaphobia to signal your own moral sophistication
darkmatter
  • Total Posts : 17321
  • Status: offline
Re: ISIS Talk & Speculation 2017/04/16 09:38:34 (permalink)
gutlessrhyme
SW14
Islamophobia is a racket to insulate Islam from well deserved criticism. People that conflate it with racism are particularly contemptible.

Are you phobic of: 1) the Death penalty for apostates 2) Child brides 3) Stoning adulterers to death 4) Beheading people 5) Rape 6) Death for blasphemers 7) Beating your wife 8) Limb dismemberment?

I am. If you aren't, there's something wrong with you. That doesn't mean that you hate all Muslims and that all Muslims behave like this or believe this, but we should ALL be phobic of such disgusting beliefs that claim to be the total solution for all mankind.


How about FUCK YOU.


Helping prove the "let's sit around and talk this through sensibly" option always works out well ha. I think ideally you should've added a "dude" to the end of that for maximum effect.

I think sw14 has a 'bee in his bonnet' about this while neglecting other factors, which I've made clear I disagree with, but I wouldn't say he's being racist.

I saw a jokes interview the other day with a black interviewee re. Rachel Dolezal.
Q: do you think she's being racist?
A: bla bla yes bla bla bla
Q: but she claims there's no such thing as race and that it's a sociological construct?
A: that's true
Q: but she's still racist?
A: yep

Kandee
  • Total Posts : 1813
  • Status: offline
Re: ISIS Talk & Speculation 2017/04/16 09:58:28 (permalink)
So to sum up:
Isis is an ideology, just as misogyny is.
wiseacre
  • Total Posts : 18588
  • Status: offline
Re: ISIS Talk & Speculation 2017/04/16 10:02:03 (permalink)
Shut up

no
simon.r
  • Total Posts : 4244
  • Status: offline
Re: ISIS Talk & Speculation 2017/04/16 10:02:39 (permalink)
darkmatter
gutlessrhyme
SW14
Islamophobia is a racket to insulate Islam from well deserved criticism. People that conflate it with racism are particularly contemptible.

Are you phobic of: 1) the Death penalty for apostates 2) Child brides 3) Stoning adulterers to death 4) Beheading people 5) Rape 6) Death for blasphemers 7) Beating your wife 8) Limb dismemberment?

I am. If you aren't, there's something wrong with you. That doesn't mean that you hate all Muslims and that all Muslims behave like this or believe this, but we should ALL be phobic of such disgusting beliefs that claim to be the total solution for all mankind.


How about FUCK YOU.


Helping prove the "let's sit around and talk this through sensibly" option always works out well ha. I think ideally you should've added a "dude" to the end of that for maximum effect.

I think sw14 has a 'bee in his bonnet' about this while neglecting other factors, which I've made clear I disagree with, but I wouldn't say he's being racist.

I saw a jokes interview the other day with a black interviewee re. Rachel Dolezal.
Q: do you think she's being racist?
A: bla bla yes bla bla bla
Q: but she claims there's no such thing as race and that it's a sociological construct?
A: that's true
Q: but she's still racist?
A: yep



 
It was odd how a lot of the people who preach gender tolerance and stuff immediately got the knives out for her. Wouldn't even entertain the idea that perhaps she's a bit mental, nope, she's appropriating culture and that's the end of it.
Goodone
  • Total Posts : 4116
  • Status: offline
Re: ISIS Talk & Speculation 2017/04/16 10:11:09 (permalink)
There is definitely a pecking order to which set of rights you should feel more outraged by... gay gender stuff lower end racism upper end with islamaphobia at the extreme... e.g. Islam condemns gays yet people defend Islam and label people who criticise it islamaphobes despite the rampant intolerance behind it's message
post edited by Goodone - 2017/04/16 10:12:26
gutlessrhyme
  • Total Posts : 18959
  • Status: offline
Re: ISIS Talk & Speculation 2017/04/16 10:19:50 (permalink)
There's a difference between being critical towards a religion (or religion in general) and blaming terrorist attacks on the religion itself and thus making the millions of innocent Muslims take the fall for it.

SW14
  • Total Posts : 7921
  • Status: offline
Re: ISIS Talk & Speculation 2017/04/16 10:38:28 (permalink)
gutlessrhyme
There's a difference between being critical towards a religion (or religion in general) and blaming terrorist attacks on the religion itself and thus making the millions of innocent Muslims take the fall for it.


Muslims are taught that the Koran and Sunnah are the final, unalterable word of God.

The Prophet Mohammed was the perfect example for all of humanity for all time.

When that book teaches you that Christians and Jews are second class citizens, that apostates should be killed, that blasphemers should be killed, that heretics should be killed, that there is no higher calling than jihad, that it is okay to rob and take sex slaves in battle, that Mohammed could behead an entire Jewish tribe with his own hand then that causes a very real problem.

Most people thankfully won't copy this behaviour but sadly there will always be people who will, believing they are merely carrying out God's will.

https://www.google.de/amp/s/mobile.nytimes.com/2015/12/27/world/asia/flawed-justice-after-a-mob-killed-an-afghan-woman.amp.html

Every single one of this barbaric lynch mob who kicked and punched this woman to death over a false rumour that she had burnt a Koran thought he was doing his religious duty.

I have a bee in my bonnet about Islam because I consider it to be an enemy of hard fought freedoms and I don't think many people actually understand what we are dealing with.
Kandee
  • Total Posts : 1813
  • Status: offline
Re: ISIS Talk & Speculation 2017/04/16 10:51:52 (permalink)
That is also an example of misogyny extremism. Another ideology that is not race specific.
SW14
  • Total Posts : 7921
  • Status: offline
Re: ISIS Talk & Speculation 2017/04/16 10:54:10 (permalink)
Kandee
That is also an example of misogyny extremism. Another ideology that is not race specific.


When a religion clearly tells you that you can beat your wife and that blasphemers should be killed, it's really not hard to see how it produces that kind of disgusting scene.

It's not just women.

https://www.google.de/amp/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/39593302 this guy was torn limb from limb at university by his fellow students for alleged blasphemy just yesterday.

Asad Shah was butchered to death on the streets of Glasgow here not long ago for a similar "transgression".
post edited by SW14 - 2017/04/16 11:00:23
Kandee
  • Total Posts : 1813
  • Status: offline
Re: ISIS Talk & Speculation 2017/04/16 11:01:22 (permalink)
I'm not disputing that.

I referenced your example of the lynch mob beating a woman because there is another dimension of terrorism at play there: 'misogyny extremism' and it is not race or religion specific...
Isis is an ideology independent of Islam.
post edited by Kandee - 2017/04/16 11:03:32
Goodone
  • Total Posts : 4116
  • Status: offline
Re: ISIS Talk & Speculation 2017/04/16 11:34:45 (permalink)
gutlessrhyme
There's a difference between being critical towards a religion (or religion in general) and blaming terrorist attacks on the religion itself and thus making the millions of innocent Muslims take the fall for it.



Why are you so sure Islam is not to blame? Please don't quote an  old testament passage at me or state that English Empire was evil... Basically do you have anything to back this up?
 
No one is blaming the millions of innocent muslims... can we drop this line of argument now please
darkmatter
  • Total Posts : 17321
  • Status: offline
Re: ISIS Talk & Speculation 2017/04/16 11:36:28 (permalink)
simon.r

It was odd how a lot of the people who preach gender tolerance and stuff immediately got the knives out for her. Wouldn't even entertain the idea that perhaps she's a bit mental, nope, she's appropriating culture and that's the end of it.


So true. In fact society tends to have this problem, readily portraying these people as evil pariahs rather than accepting they may have mental health issues (even in the absence of any formal diagnosis).

I once worked with about 20 ~25 year olds in the same team, they were all taking the piss out of one guy in the team. One day I explained I thought he was mildly autistic and all the piss taking / bullying suddenly stopped. Weird that until there's a formal term on it, people are perfectly happy to be cunts.

SW14
  • Total Posts : 7921
  • Status: offline
Re: ISIS Talk & Speculation 2017/04/16 11:43:16 (permalink)
Goodone
gutlessrhyme
There's a difference between being critical towards a religion (or religion in general) and blaming terrorist attacks on the religion itself and thus making the millions of innocent Muslims take the fall for it.



Why are you so sure Islam is not to blame? Please don't quote an  old testament passage at me or state that English Empire was evil... Basically do you have anything to back this up?
 
No one is blaming the millions of innocent muslims... can we drop this line of argument now please


I consider the 1.6 million Muslims to be hostage to and victims of a hugely oppressive faith.

In Islamic societies, criticism of the religion is banned. Usually at pain of death.

Leaving the religion is banned, too. At the sharp of a sword.
darkmatter
  • Total Posts : 17321
  • Status: offline
Re: ISIS Talk & Speculation 2017/04/16 11:54:07 (permalink)
Same as the penalty for leaving the IMF / world bank / petrodollar then

DrumBongo
  • Total Posts : 1902
  • Status: offline
Re: ISIS Talk & Speculation 2017/04/16 12:05:08 (permalink)
Lol, nice comparison 
 
Is that less evil as it has no explicit ideology?
 
 
Goodone
  • Total Posts : 4116
  • Status: offline
Re: ISIS Talk & Speculation 2017/04/16 12:16:10 (permalink)
How is that a nice comparison lol... It's in no way comparable pointing out how the west has faults does not excuse the rise of religious facism... making such comparisons although witty and may earn cheap points actually obfuscates the issue and allows the perpetuation of ideologies we have fought so hard to beat in the past
Shiverman
  • Total Posts : 10346
  • Status: online
Re: ISIS Talk & Speculation 2017/04/16 12:17:55 (permalink)
Far Right groups have taken responsibility for the Bundasliga attacks. How is that gonna fit into this narrative?
http://news.sky.com/story...rtmund-blasts-10838440
 
 

It's in no way comparable pointing out how the west has faults does not excuse the rise of religious facism...

 
lol.
post edited by Shiverman - 2017/04/16 12:19:19
Page: < 12345.. > >> Showing page 4 of 11
Jump to:
© 2017 APG vNext Commercial Version 5.0