AnsweredHot!Politics Thread

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RUSSELL CLARTY
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Re: Politics Thread 2018/08/09 09:05:55 (permalink)
Whagwan
 

Come on, he's exactly the kind of person this dog whistle is designed to appeal to.




 
Goodone maybe. But SW14 is educated and can think critically. I'd hope to separate his animosity towards Wahabism from the real issue of Boris's article he could see just how disingenuous and dangerous this all is


SW14
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Re: Politics Thread 2018/08/09 09:06:12 (permalink)
sectionate
Is the skull cap a normal form of dress?
 
Not to us, but it is to them. That's what you can't understand. Our norms are not their norms, and vice versa. 


Does it deliberately prevent communication and human interaction? No. They are chalk and cheese. I’ve worked with numerous people wearing kippahs but none in a niqab.

An imam has come out behind Boris saying he didn’t go far enough:

But Dr Taj Hargey, the imam at the Oxford Islamic Congregation, has said the MP should “not apologise for telling the truth”.

In a letter to the Times, he wrote: “The burka and niqab are hideous tribal ninja-like garments that are pre-Islamic, non-Koranic and therefore un-Muslim.

Although this deliberate identity-concealing contraption is banned at the Kaaba in Mecca, it is permitted in Britain


Many Muslims can’t stand these things either. They are worn by the lunatic fringe and are Gulf centric, making inroads into traditional South Asian dress (which has never been this extreme).
post edited by SW14 - 2018/08/09 09:08:47
Whagwan
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Re: Politics Thread 2018/08/09 09:11:00 (permalink)
Jungle Dave
Whagwan
 

Come on, he's exactly the kind of person this dog whistle is designed to appeal to.




 
Goodone maybe. But SW14 is educated and can think critically. I'd hope to separate his animosity towards Wahabism from the real issue of Boris's article he could see just how disingenuous and dangerous this all is




Well I think it's obvious from this thread and the responses you're being very generous, he cannot separate the two issues.
RUSSELL CLARTY
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Re: Politics Thread 2018/08/09 09:13:03 (permalink)
SW14


An imam imam has come out behind Boris saying he didn’t go far enough:

But Dr Taj Hargey, the imam at the Oxford Islamic Congregation, has said the MP should “not apologise for telling the truth”.

In a letter to the Times, he wrote: “The burka and niqab are hideous tribal ninja-like garments that are pre-Islamic, non-Koranic and therefore un-Muslim.

Although this deliberate identity-concealing contraption is banned at the Kaaba in Mecca, it is permitted in Britain




 
Dr Taj Targey may have an opinion but his status as imam at the Oxford Islamic Congregation doesn't qualify him to speak for the entire Muslim world, or even UK Muslims. Or even Muslims that wear Burkas in Oxford. 
 
Again "ninja-like" is a jibe, an insult, rather than an objective statement that he might make- eg, that the Burka is potentially symptomatic of a patriarchal society that subjugates women.
 
What is banned and isn't banned in Saudi Arabia (I mean, FFS) should have fuck all influence on what we deign to be legal.  
 
 


RUSSELL CLARTY
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Re: Politics Thread 2018/08/09 09:14:27 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby Whagwan 2018/08/09 09:18:08
 
Whagwan
 
 
 
Well I think it's obvious from this thread and the responses you're being very generous, he cannot separate the two issues.




You've got to have hope! 
 
 


Sheriff Lobo
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Re: Politics Thread 2018/08/09 09:18:31 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby S8 2018/08/09 09:26:58
sectionate
Is the skull cap a normal form of dress?
 
Not to us, but it is to them. That's what you can't understand. Our norms are not their norms, and vice versa. 




Yeah this.
 
I sort of get where you'e coming from SW14, but your posts do sometimes read like "They're culture is different, I don't fully understand why they have to be different, and I don't like it one bit" ... I'm not for one second claiming I completely understand the reasons why someone would want to wear a burqa, but I don't think you have to. Personally, I just accept that its their choice.
 
And one thing that's always baffled me is your tendency to hold up Western Capitalist culture as some sort of gold standard that the rest of the world should be trying to attain... for some reason this doesn't sit right with me at all... we're certainly different, but not necessarily 'better' imo.
 
I appreciate that was a bit of a wishy washy 'here's some of my thoughts' kind of post.
 
okthnkxbye
 
 
SW14
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Re: Politics Thread 2018/08/09 09:25:03 (permalink)
Jungle Dave
SW14


An imam imam has come out behind Boris saying he didn’t go far enough:

But Dr Taj Hargey, the imam at the Oxford Islamic Congregation, has said the MP should “not apologise for telling the truth”.

In a letter to the Times, he wrote: “The burka and niqab are hideous tribal ninja-like garments that are pre-Islamic, non-Koranic and therefore un-Muslim.

Although this deliberate identity-concealing contraption is banned at the Kaaba in Mecca, it is permitted in Britain




 
Dr Taj Targey may have an opinion but his status as imam at the Oxford Islamic Congregation doesn't qualify him to speak for the entire Muslim world, or even UK Muslims. Or even Muslims that wear Burkas in Oxford. 
 
Again "ninja-like" is a jibe, an insult, rather than an objective statement that he might make- eg, that the Burka is potentially symptomatic of a patriarchal society that subjugates women.
 
What is banned and isn't banned in Saudi Arabia (I mean, FFS) should have fuck all influence on what we deign to be legal.  
 
 



No one can speak for the entire Muslim world or UK Muslims, that’s part of the problem. That doesn’t invalidate his point though.

His status as an Islamic scholar and Oxford don with a doctorate does qualify him to echo Boris’ sentiment that there is no religious justification for this extreme attire.
Whagwan
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Re: Politics Thread 2018/08/09 09:27:37 (permalink)
Sheriff Lobo
 
And one thing that's always baffled me is your tendency to hold up Western Capitalist culture as some sort of gold standard that the rest of the world should be trying to attain...
 



 
Oh god, Proud Boy Goodone incoming.


post edited by Whagwan - 2018/08/09 09:36:11
SW14
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Re: Politics Thread 2018/08/09 09:31:29 (permalink)
Sheriff Lobo
sectionate
Is the skull cap a normal form of dress?
 
Not to us, but it is to them. That's what you can't understand. Our norms are not their norms, and vice versa. 




Yeah this.
 
I sort of get where you'e coming from SW14, but your posts do sometimes read like "They're culture is different, I don't fully understand why they have to be different, and I don't like it one bit" ... I'm not for one second claiming I completely understand the reasons why someone would want to wear a burqa, but I don't think you have to. Personally, I just accept that its their choice.
 
And one thing that's always baffled me is your tendency to hold up Western Capitalist culture as some sort of gold standard that the rest of the world should be trying to attain... for some reason this doesn't sit right with me at all... we're certainly different, but not necessarily 'better' imo.
 
I appreciate that was a bit of a wishy washy 'here's some of my thoughts' kind of post.
 
okthnkxbye
 
 


I’m not here to preach to the rest of the world about how they should operate but I do think that Western liberal democracies are the best places on earth. There must be something in this given the levels of migration to the West. While we are generally tolerant, the kind of ultra-extreme ideology and attire represented is beyond the pale for many. It is deliberate isolation and marginalization by design.

Extreme religiosity makes many Brits uncomfortable. We are happy to laugh at “bible bashing” Christians but are scared of our own shadow when it’s another culture, even if it is the most extreme and unpleasant subset of it around.
S8
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Re: Politics Thread 2018/08/09 09:31:51 (permalink)
Sheriff Lobo
sectionate
Is the skull cap a normal form of dress?
 
Not to us, but it is to them. That's what you can't understand. Our norms are not their norms, and vice versa. 




Yeah this.
 
I sort of get where you'e coming from SW14, but your posts do sometimes read like "They're culture is different, I don't fully understand why they have to be different, and I don't like it one bit" ... I'm not for one second claiming I completely understand the reasons why someone would want to wear a burqa, but I don't think you have to. Personally, I just accept that its their choice.
 



This, part of being a multi-cultural and tolerant nation (paging Goodone) is accepting other peoples differences and not berating them in national papers for it. 
RAYZA
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Re: Politics Thread 2018/08/09 09:37:01 (permalink)
sectionate
Sheriff Lobo
sectionate
Is the skull cap a normal form of dress?
 
Not to us, but it is to them. That's what you can't understand. Our norms are not their norms, and vice versa. 




Yeah this.
 
I sort of get where you'e coming from SW14, but your posts do sometimes read like "They're culture is different, I don't fully understand why they have to be different, and I don't like it one bit" ... I'm not for one second claiming I completely understand the reasons why someone would want to wear a burqa, but I don't think you have to. Personally, I just accept that its their choice.
 



This, part of being a multi-cultural and tolerant nation (paging Goodone) is accepting other peoples differences and not berating them in national papers for it. 


He has a foreign Mrs, HTH
RUSSELL CLARTY
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Re: Politics Thread 2018/08/09 09:43:03 (permalink)
SW14



No one can speak for the entire Muslim world or UK Muslims, that’s part of the problem. That doesn’t invalidate his point though.




 
His point is, that Boris "shouldn't apologise" for mocking an entire section of society from the platform of a national newspaper during a climate of tension- because the burka looks like it might be worn by a ninja. Literally more of the same rubbish. 
 
I'd say his point is fucking badly made at best and a lot of good faith and squinting that it isn't an invalid one. 
 
 


Whagwan
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Re: Politics Thread 2018/08/09 09:43:26 (permalink)
He's got a Chinese missus.  Plenty of racists/xenophobes have a wierd blind spot/fetishisation of Oriental women.
RUSSELL CLARTY
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Re: Politics Thread 2018/08/09 09:44:32 (permalink)
Fuck me, so they do. 
 
WTF is that about? 


SW14
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Re: Politics Thread 2018/08/09 09:49:07 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby MalcolmTucker 2018/08/09 10:15:28
Sexual Marxism imo.
OEM
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Re: Politics Thread 2018/08/09 09:50:17 (permalink)
Ever shagged a Chinese bird or been with one a couple weeks?


SW14
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Re: Politics Thread 2018/08/09 09:56:03 (permalink)
Jungle Dave
SW14



No one can speak for the entire Muslim world or UK Muslims, that’s part of the problem. That doesn’t invalidate his point though.




 
His point is, that Boris "shouldn't apologise" for mocking an entire section of society from the platform of a national newspaper during a climate of tension- because the burka looks like it might be worn by a ninja. Literally more of the same rubbish. 
 
I'd say his point is fucking badly made at best and a lot of good faith and squinting that it isn't an invalid one. 
 
 


An “entire section”? You mean a couple of thousand at most Islamic fundamentalists? There are bigger things to worry about than this at the moment and he was instrumental in the main one. That’s my only complaint with this article.

I’d love to see the social attitudes of burqabis polled so that some of you could see the intolerant and intolerable ideology these garments represent, but that would involve them being allowed to speak.
LHC
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Re: Politics Thread 2018/08/09 09:56:40 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby Whagwan 2018/08/09 10:03:34
Whagwan
He's got a Chinese missus.  Plenty of racists/xenophobes have a wierd blind spot/fetishisation of Oriental women.

I suspect, like Jeremy Cunt, he doesn't actually know what type of Asian.
RAYZA
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Re: Politics Thread 2018/08/09 10:03:28 (permalink)
My mate votes tory and is against immigration but he's only ever had foreign girlfriends. I don't get it.
RUSSELL CLARTY
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Re: Politics Thread 2018/08/09 10:04:16 (permalink)
@ SW14




Debating what constitutes "an entire section" aside for the sake of brevity, I repeat that not only those wearing the burka are at a heightened risk of abuse owing to his comments, but also South Asians in general and of course by degrees anyone else breathing British air.  
 
Do you really think most of these women are "fundamentalists"? I doubt half of them have a fucking clue about politics. Except for when they get flobbed on. 


SW14
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Re: Politics Thread 2018/08/09 10:08:31 (permalink)
If, as I am assured, they have agency over their decision then yes they are Islamic fundamentalists. If not then they are being forced to wear them or brainwashed into it by their Islamic fundamentalist husbands or family.

Neither is an optimal scenario but the fact is that they are the calling card of radical Islam. They represent far more than a piece of clothing.

You won’t find many laissez faire secular Muslims wearing a burqa.
post edited by SW14 - 2018/08/09 10:11:27
Whagwan
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Re: Politics Thread 2018/08/09 10:10:39 (permalink)
Jungle Dave
Fuck me, so they do. 
 
WTF is that about? 




Chauvanistic fantasies of servility?
Original Nuttah
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Re: Politics Thread 2018/08/09 10:18:19 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby S8 2018/08/09 10:22:55
OEM
Ever shagged a Chinese bird or been with one a couple weeks?

Once you've shagged one you fancy another one about half an hour later.
RUSSELL CLARTY
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Re: Politics Thread 2018/08/09 10:21:24 (permalink)
SW14
If, as I am assured, they have agency over their decision then yes they are Islamic fundamentalists. If not then they are being forced to wear them or brainwashed into it by their Islamic fundamentalist husbands or family.

 
I don't believe for a minute that all the women who wear the burka have agency over this decision. And this is wrong in a supposedly enlightened society. But to mock the potential victims of what I suspect to be a grotesquely patriarchal facet of Wahabism is perverse and dangerous. 

Neither is an optimal scenario but the fact is that they are the calling card of radical Islam. They represent far more than a piece of clothing.



 
They aren't a calling card. Do ISIS leave burkas lying around the scene of an atrocity? 
 
They may well represent more than a piece of clothing, but again, to equate wearing a burka with leaving the Ace of Spades on the bloodied body of a victim of terrorism is both ridiculous and dangerous.  
 
There are issues here, but they have to be dealt with in a manner befitting a civilised society 
 
 
 


LHC
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Re: Politics Thread 2018/08/09 10:26:41 (permalink)
Jungle Dave

 
There are issues here, but Let's have mass uncontrolled immigration, free housing, benefits and let them live under their own value system and silence anyone who complains

Oh wait we already do that


fixed for CHUDone
SW14
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Re: Politics Thread 2018/08/09 10:52:15 (permalink)
The thought police sniffing around already.

She continued: "I have to think of this as a police officer.

"I can tell you that some people have clearly found it offensive.

"I can also tell you that I spoke last night to my very experience officers who deal with hate crime.

"And although we have not yet received any allegation of such a crime, I can tell you that my preliminary view from having spoken to them is that what Mr Johnson said would not reach the bar for a criminal offence.

"He did not commit a criminal offence."


It shows the mess we are in when this ridiculous woman who should’ve been sacked after Stockwell is nosying around with “hate crime” officers discussing criminal merit.
wiseacre
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Re: Politics Thread 2018/08/09 11:04:42 (permalink)
LHC
Whagwan
He's got a Chinese missus.  Plenty of racists/xenophobes have a wierd blind spot/fetishisation of Oriental women.

I suspect, like Jeremy Cunt, he doesn't actually know what type of Asian.



https://www.nytimes.com/2018/01/06/opinion/sunday/alt-right-asian-fetish.html
 
https://www.vice.com/en_id/article/9kqqn3/whats-the-deal-with-mens-rights-activists-and-asian-fetishes
 

no
S8
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Re: Politics Thread 2018/08/09 11:14:55 (permalink)

KNUCKLES
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Re: Politics Thread 2018/08/09 11:21:44 (permalink)
Heard some former Tory mp using that patriot word to justify the latest Boris quagmire, Bannon’s favourite word becoming common parlance in the upcoming months.
SW14
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Re: Politics Thread 2018/08/09 11:28:47 (permalink)
I remember President Bannon and all that shit when Trump won the election. There’s a tendency to massively overstate his importance imo. I don’t think he’s some dark lord pulling the strings here, I think he’s an idiot.
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